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+--- Thread: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books, including LST) (/thread-22.html)
RE: The Fool (spoilers for Farseer, Liveship Traders & Tawny Man) - Farseer - Feb-17-2011
Quick post, and no research to back up...just a 'Fool's feeling'!
In The Golden Fool, Fitz, Fool and Dutiful are talking about a set of puppets Dutiful gave to Elliania as a gift. The puppets were carved by a "skilful carver" named Bluntner...I've a feeling these puppets were actually made by Fool, whose works are being sold under the Bluntner label? Am I chasing more shadows?
The passage is toward the end of Chapter Three, 'Echoes' if anyone is interested!
RE: The Fool (spoilers for Farseer, Liveship Traders & Tawny Man) - Farseer - Jun-19-2011
(Oct-26-2010, 06:36 PM (UTC))Farseer Wrote: I can't STAND it anymore! What's with Fool and apricots? He drinks apricot brandy and then asks for apricots in FF (when Fitz brought him back plums to Aslevjal instead)?!
Are they just something he likes or is there some significance to them? There HAS to be some significance doesn't there, particularly as Fool hadn't had a hunkering for them while at Buckkeep the first time around? As far as I have been able to find, nothing of apricots is mentioned in the Farseer books, let alone connected to Fool.
Amber and Althea shared apricot brandy in LST (EDIT: apparently these two only shared 'brandy', not specifically 'apricot brandy' END EDIT), as did Fitz and Fool from their very first reunion meeting in the TM series. Fool later mentioned somewhere (I think?) that he'd had the bottles shipped from Bingtown or thereabouts, using his wealth to purchase them as they were ridiculously expensive?
Fitz also liked the brandy, and he and Fool even shared some from a flask while within the Elderling city.
The colour of apricots seemed to fairly well match Amber and Lord Golden's colouring for a while there....maybe that's something?
Fool also always complained of being cold. Maybe he drank the brandy for its spreading warmth, to counteract that cold feeling? Fitz recalls the brandy as "Apricots and the heady warmth of a summer day flooded me."
Did you know there actually is a 'golden amber' type of apricot?
Well, I thought I was on to something with this but now, after realising that apricots don't have hairy seeds, I am not so sure! Here's what I mean...
I got to thinking about the ancient tapestry that Reyn used as a backdrop for a dream he had shared with Malta (it was one of his favourite tapestries and I think it was the second dream-box dream they'd shared, when Tintaglia first showed herself to Malta, and not the first). The tapestry depicted a nature scene that consisted of black, leafless trees that bore yellow fruit (the black trunks also jump out at me but I will ignore them for now!). At one point, when Tintaglia appears with them in the dream, the fruits ripen and fall from the tree, with one falling and splitting near Malta's feet. The smell of the nectar from this fruit was described as being 'decadent'.
What got me really excited is that Fitz also describes apricot brandy as being 'decadently good', so I instantly connected the two and thought, 'Ah! Apricots are the fruits depicted in the tapestry and must be important as they are featured in the tapestry and dream. They are also from the region of Kelsingra and are connected to Fool who is similar to the tall, golden-skinned beings who Fitz and Reyn etc have described as inhabiting the city and area." I know this is a whole other conversation re Elderlings etc but I will have to come back to it!
Now, given that Reyn and Malta are dreaming via the dream-box (which is, as we know, made to work by the use of wizardwood and therefore of dragon/Elderling origin, and/or make), I gathered that they are within the Skill in some way with other dream-box users (other lovers who also appear in their dream) or in the vicinity of Kelsingra as possibly depicted within the tapestry.
In Dragon Haven, Thymara and Tats found yellow fruits that were 'fat and sweet' however Thymara couldn't remember their name as they didn't commonly grow near Trehaug (they were nearer the vicinity of Kelsingra at the time they found them). Whatever they were, they were different to the sour pears she had found much earlier and also the red fruits, or apples, that Jess had supplied. Carson, too, had previously found a yellow, sweet fruit that could have been the same as those found by Thymara and Tats.
While apricots are more often said to be orange, they do tend to range in colour from yellow through to partially red, depending on ripeness or exposure to sunlight HOWEVER...Thymara mentions that her fruits had a 'fuzzy seed', which apricots don't have!
So, I thought I was on to something with the significance of apricots (I can't believe Fool just 'likes' them!), but it seems I wasn't. Darn you, unfuzzy apricot seeds!!
EDIT: Of course, RotE-type apricots could have fuzzy seeds! *begs Robin Hobb*
RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - 'thul - Jun-19-2011
These beings believe you see connections where there are none again, Farseer.
They have a feeling that a good portion of Rain wild plants and fruits are similar to earthly growths, but do not truly exist outside RotE. Also, apricots do not grow in jungles.
RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - Farseer - Jun-19-2011
(Jun-19-2011, 04:00 PM (UTC))thul Wrote: These beings believe you see connections where there are none again, Farseer.
Yes, I must concur that aspects of my previous post is a sad example of the truth of that, 'thul.
Having actually found the passage in DH, Tats and Thymara's fruits were collected from vines, not trees, so this already-dubious Kelsingra link to Reyn's tapestry proved to be nothing but wishful thinking.
Still, I am not giving up!
There is something about apricots and the Fool that is significant, and I can't quite give up my hold on the fruit in the dream-box dream yet either as it is just too oddly out of place...who takes note of what a fruit smells like when you are meeting in a lover's dream and there is a storm looming/dragon coming?!RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - 'thul - Jun-20-2011
In a dream landscape like that, there are few distractions for the senses. If the only things present are the dreamers, a fruit tree and a dragon, you will naturally take notice of the fruit. (of course, there might have been other things present there, but that these beings cannot recall)
You should not forget that it is quite probable that Robin Hobb has a few elements that have no meaning beyond what is visible. Who knows? maybe she simply likes apricots?
RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - Omie - Jun-27-2011
Some semi-interesting 'Fool' facts and coincidences (or not):
The Fool card in games played with a Tarot deck is a 'wild card'. Like the character, in certain circumstances it can change its identity to be something else.
Some traditional English morris dances involve a dancer who weaves in and out of the dance skillfully without really being a part of the main dance itself. This person is, of course, known as the 'fool'.
As well as the obvious reference in the title to the phrase 'Fool's errand', it might be worth pointing out that the phrase 'A fool and his money are soon parted' also comes true. I wonder if there are any more? Hah, well I suppose Fitz literally did 'make a fool of himself', so that's another phrase creeping in there. Now I'm trying to think of more 'fool' idioms, but I suspect that after 'fool's errand' they're all coincidences.
RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - Farseer - Jun-28-2011
Love it, Omie!
RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - Apricot - Jun-28-2011
I can't find the thread I read this in right now but thought it best to pop it here.
Regarding when Fitz went to the Fool's room and saw the doll that looked so life like. I just read a bit in Ship of Magic where Althea describes the wares they sell in the Bingtiwn markets on Rain Wild St, it reads:
"The toy shops always lured Althea the strongest: there one could find dolls whose liquid eyes and soft warm skin mimicked that of a real infant..."
RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - Omie - Jul-04-2011
Reading the Rain Wild Chronicles and I was struck with a sudden sense of unfairness as I thought of yet another Scene I Would Like To Read But Robin Hobb Will Probably Never Write.... a conversation between Mercor and the Fool. They're both share a history of mysterious foresight. Mercor/Maulkin is even both white and gold. And I think that Mercor would just be the most understanding of the debt of gratitude dragonkind owes the Fool. I suspect most of the others would see him as a glorified two-legs who ought to have been giddy with delight about the prospect of sacrificing himself in the salvation of a superior species. Not that I expected him to ever ask for thanks or even credit, but, well, it would still have been nice if he got it.
(Jun-28-2011, 02:28 PM (UTC))Apricot Wrote: "The toy shops always lured Althea the strongest: there one could find dolls whose liquid eyes and soft warm skin mimicked that of a real infant..."
I was assuming the Fool's dolly was a relic from his childhood. Perhaps the Southlands is another place littered about with Elderling antiques.
The figurine of a baby that Etta retrieved from the Others Island was also described fairly similarly.
RE: The Fool (spoilers for all RotE books) - fool-ish - Jul-07-2011
The fool is as complex and confusing a character to me now as when I read Assassin's Apprentice! Male or female, I still don't know, although I do err more towards male as Fitz didn't express any surprise when he stripped fool of the sacking in readiness for the funeral pyre. Other dialogue throughout the books would infer his gender was male also. Then again 'scentless' knocks it all out of flunter, perhaps implying 'different' or 'inactive' hormones? I know little about Amber as I haven't read Liveships yet so can't really speak about this 'persona' but I suspect I may be even more flummoxed when I have read them!
Whatever the case, I adore and miss Beloved badly after finishing Tawny Man. Gah! I'm missing them all!
< Nosy included!