Others' Island (spoilers all books incl RWC)

[Farseer]

Ok, so, I think this is going to be the most far-fetched thing I've put here on thePlenty but...*takes a big breath, lets it out and settles at the keyboard*...

Going back to the objects on Others Island, the rosebud that Kennit took from Gankis, and what it represented, has been niggling at me.

'He (Gankis) took a rosebud from his pocket. Kennit took it from him carefully, wary of the thorns.' It then goes on to describe that the rose looked real and was even fragranced like a rose should be.

Later, when in front of the Other, after Kennit crushed the glass sphere with the tumblers inside it: 'Wisely, he forebore a similar treatment for the rose. He suspected its delicate beauty was created from some material that would not give way to his boot's pressure.'

Now, the only other place where a rose is clearly mentioned in the RotE, that I can think of, is when Fool later talks about white and red roses at the end of Fool's Fate. He and Fitz are in Aslevjal and Fool is trying to get Fitz to understand how it is that a dragon can cause the transformation of a human into an Elderling or a human can cause the changing of a dragon into an Other etc: 'Have you ever seen a white rose that has grown for years in proximity to a red?...After years of such closeness, there is an exchange. It shows most plainly in the white roses, for they may take on a rosy blush, or exhibit faint tendrils of red in what used to be snowy white blossoms. It happens because there has been an exchange of the very stuff of their beings."

In this, I wonder if the rose represents the future reunion of dragons and humans in the world? The only trouble with this theory is that we aren't told its colour!!

Arrgh! Lost half of my post and can't remember what I wrote!! *sigh* It's possibly worth mentioning a couple of other things with regard to the rose in other literature:

* Dante represented his 'beloved' as a rose

* In alchemy, the rose is primarily a symbol of the operation of Conjunction, the Mystical Marriage of opposites. It represents the regeneration of separated essences and their resurrection on a new level.

* As a symbol of the Mystical Marriage on a personal level, the red rose represents a special kind of love in which one “melts away” into the beauty of another, and the old identity is surrendered for that of the beloved or a higher identity within oneself. In this sense, the rose is a symbol of complete surrender and permanent transmutation.

Sounds kind of like the relationship between Fool and Fitz (in that Fool and Fitz, and even Fitz with Nighteyes surrendered their old identities for a time...and they are 'as one'), and also what occurs between dragons and humans etc?? *grasping*!!

There are LOTS of other references eg also in alchemy, the red rose is regarded as masculine and the white feminine. The combination of both symbolizes the birth of the Philosopher’s Child, Mercury; the flower is the female and the thorns the male (obstacles guarding the female) etc and could therefore be considered as a representation of duality in nature; and Cirlot writes : "The single Rose is, in essence a symbol of completion, of consumate achievement and perfection... the mystic centre, the heart, the garden of Eros, the paradise of Dante, the beloved, the emblem of Venus and so on...."

Could any of this shed light on the Others Island rose? Throwing the duality of El and Eda and even the aspects of Sa into the mix, let alone those of Fool/Amber/Beloved! Or is it more personal to Kennit?

Though it possibly belongs in another thread, I wonder if what Fool had to say about the white and red roses could also be used as an analogy for what occurs between he and Fitz (in that being around Fitz, he is reminded more often of what it is like to be human) as well as humans and dragons? Could it even go further and allude to the fact that the more change Fool encourages, and therefore the more physical changes he personally undergoes, he is actually becoming more and more human each time, or is he changing to something different altogether? All very interesting...may mean something, may mean nothing !!!