[split] What does the name "Farseer" really mean? SPOILERS ALL BOOKS

[Valarya]

Just a quick visit here but I so very much want to come back to discuss it all...

**City of Dragons spoiler to about Chapter Three (so if you've read the publisher pdfs, as featured on the main news page, you'll be fine)*

Spoiler

The number twelve cannot represent the actual number of Skill-Pillars. There are five in the King of Chalced's Throne Room, (which I assume to be located in the map tower of an old Elderling city?), four for the Witness Stones at Buck, one at the plaza where Fool and Fitz had their joint 'vision', one in the quarry, one in the Stone Garden, one on Others' Island and one in the map tower of Aslevjal. That alone is fourteen without any others. Unless one 'Pillar' (as in each of the twelve Pillars of the Man Ceremony) does only denote or represent one destination or Portal Gate grouping...but I doubt it...I think! Who else went when they read of those five blocks of memory stone?!

Oooooh yes!!!!

Same CoD spoilers that Farseer mentioned, nothing more:

When I saw this it reminded me of the discussion here somewhere about the 'center' of the world - or map. We know Buckkeep was a very prominent place in the world of the Elderlings for having 4 whole Skill Pillars in one place. When I saw FIVE there in Chalced I thought to myself "oh my gods this is it, this is the central home of Elderlings!"

It has to be. It makes the most sense based on where we know all the other Pillars to be. (And thinking of the other Pillars that are now on the bottom of the ocean along with the rest of the used-to-be coastline.)

I think this brings about entirely new ideas about the Elderlings realm and whether border-lines even existed. I believe the Farseers are definitely descended from Elderlings... but oh my what about the rulers of Chalced!?

[Farseer]

It says in AA, "It requires a Man to sponsor and name the candidate, and he must find a dozen other Men who concede the boy is worthy and ready" so, yes, it does seem that it requires thirteen, including the sponsor....


...naming him as Changer...

Only a very fleeting visit as I finally have an opportunity to actually get stuck into City of Dragons tonight but I couldn't help but think of Changer (Fitz) when I just noticed the following in Chapter Six, and possibly a little earlier as well: *CoD spoiler*

Spoiler

In a discussion between Jani and Malta, a number of times the word 'Changed' is used in relation to the changes wrought by the Rain Wilds. I don't think we have seen this term so used in such a way until this book (feel free to confirm/deny as I'm not taking the time tonight to check! ) and so this sudden capitalisation of the letter 'c' had my body snapping to attention and my theory wheels screeching! I am going with a connection between Changer and Changed but, if I am being practical rather than fanciful, I could acknowledge that Forged, too, begins with a capital letter. Forged. Changed. Nah...I'm going to say that Forged is capitalised due to its growth from the name 'Forge' and thus Changed is due to a Changer connection!

What exactly I don't know, but there's something there! Though I know those beings known as 'thul will likely not agree..."There you go again, Farseer"...

Oh, crikey, now (on a tangent that has nothing really to do with the above!) I'm thinking how great it is that to forge something is to give form or shape to it...like the forging of a dragon and sometimes through the process of Forging besides! "Words...they're all just words, Farseer...!"

['thul]

The capital letter comes more likely from it being an object, a noun. the act of forging, on the other hand, that is a verb.
If you look at the German language, you'll see that nouns are generally always capitalized. While not the policy in English to do the same, it can be used for names or to put extra force behind a term. The German. The English. The Six Duchies. The Forged. (see the pattern?)

Spoiler

As for Changer/Changed, that is a mere coincidence. The cultural roots for the Six Duchies and Bingtown/Rain Wilds have been clearly defined different.

[Farseer]

I could acknowledge that Forged, too, begins with a capital letter.

There I go giving you beings ammo against my theories and you take it!

Yes, the pattern exists in reality, and is also very apparent in the books. Not only is there (not sure why I am really spoiler tagging this but anyhoo!) *CoD spoiler*

Spoiler

Changed

and Forged but there is also the Skilled ones and the Tattooed as well as the Others, the Three Ships folk, the Red Ships, the New Traders, the White Prophet, the Catalyst etc etc...

...but, as I said, seeing as I am being fanciful and not practical, I am going to ignore all of those 'capital' connections!

As for your comment re "The cultural roots for the Six Duchies and Bingtown/Rain Wilds have been clearly defined different", well, have they truly? Certainly there do exist current differences, and each considers the other strange or barbaric, but Changer is Changer and the Catalyst for the world, not just the SD. Not only is he a descendant of Taker, who did not begin in the SD but rather founded them, he is also descended from Elderlings and Elderlings, as a group, were not limited to one region (eg the SD) only. As far as I can see, in this, Fitz very much shares cultural roots with the Elderlings and the difference between the SD and B/the RW is of no import to the possible connection between *CoD spoiler*

Spoiler

his name, Changer, and the Changed existance being experienced by the Rain Wilders/Elderlings.

*Another CoD spoiler as an afterthought*

Spoiler

On yet another tangent that I may regret...Fitz is Changer and, as the Catalyst, does not change. Like a true catalyst, he creates change but does not change. Maybe this explains (only maybe!) why he and those of his line do not appear to change whilst other 'Elderlings' do. Though this lack of change remains to be seen, of course.

I'm debating but my head and heart are far off in the Rain Wilds ...onward to my reading!

[Narya]

In reading the SoM again, it seems clear to me that the real "farseers" in the RotE are the dragons, because they see down through the generations of shared memories. And somewhere it was mentioned in the Tawny Man series, that there was a little bit of "dragon" in the Farseer line. So could "Farseer" just be a synonym for "Dragon-kin"?

Also, as an aside, I noticed that as Kinnet was establishing his kingdom, he was repeatedly referred to as a "taker", not unlike the first Farseer, King Taker. Perhaps the high nobility of Shrewd's and Verity's kingship had the same base sorts of roots.

['thul]

Both of those ring potentially true, Narya. The ideas are intriguing and feel most possible.

[Lady Persephone]

Oh goodness, I just thought of something that might have been in the plot for the next trilogy with Fitz, if it ever comes into existence.  It relates, I promise!  I'd originally just thought of the Skill ability as the origin of the name.  Maybe the Fool's comment refers to the first Skilled Farseer's gift coming forward in time to grace Fitz with the same gift?  But I really like the other theories a lot.

But what if the name refers not only to Fitz, but to Fitz's descendants as well?  So far he only has one daughter, Nettle.  But now that he's married to Molly he might have other heirs as well.

What if one of them is the next White Prophet?  That would mean Fitz would have to take the kid to Clerres to find the Fool so the child could have a proper tutor.  It would probably also mean he'd have to go through Chalced, Jamaillia, and Bingtown, and possibly meet some characters from the Liveships Trilogy, and maybe have an unfortunate little stopover in Others Island once again.  Then the name 'Farseer' would apply literally to the child Prophet: he or she would see far, far into the future.  We'd all learn more about White Prophets, possibly about their anatomy, and joy of joys - we'd see the Fool again!    Who would be Fitz's kid's Catalyst?  Would it be Fitz himself?  Interesting concept... hm....

BINGO!  Neverbeenwise, you are wise! You foresaw all that Robin would write in her last (so far) RotE trilogy!  Except Bee is not Fitz, just his and Beloved's beautiful and powerfully gifted daughter.  She's already changed the whole world at the age of 10.  Can you imagine what she'll do in the next decades, centuries even?  I'd like to see her wind up with Boy-O.  That's just the romantic in me. ;p  Something tells me she'll be the bridge between all the kingdoms of the realm, not to mention what she'll be able to do in Kelsingra!  Definitely Dragon-kin and White combined.   <3