[split] Vampires and Vampirism

[fool-ish]

Can anyone join in this discussion? Not that I've much to say at the moment...

[Farseer]

All discussions are open to everyone so go right ahead, fool-ish!

The beings known as 'thul usually rise nicely to the dangling bait for a good discussion, even if their reasons either make no sense or aren't able to be understood due to their strange ways of communicating ...

...*pause for belly laughing*....

...so they were no doubt simply trying to lure someone with some bait of their own, as they are also prone to do. Feel free to bite!

[fool-ish]

All discussions are open to everyone so go right ahead, fool-ish!

The beings known as 'thul usually rise nicely to the dangling bait for a good discussion, even if their reasons either make no sense or aren't able to be understood due to their strange ways of communicating ...

...*pause for belly laughing*....

...so they were no doubt simply trying to lure someone with some bait of their own, as they are also prone to do. Feel free to bite!

I'll take a nibble when I know what we're discussing!

['thul]

Indeed. All discussions are open to everyone.

Core discussion here is essentially about vampires and vampirism, what would seem logical about it across innumerable series of books. What traits seem like they work, which ones do not? (and a number of other questions. Feel free to pose more of them)

[fool-ish]

The 'beings' in 'Fevre Dream' are not vampires in the true sense. This is a truly original take on the vampire myth..for me anyways. They have most of the traits of 'traditional' vampires; great strength, healing abilities, beauty, speed, agility and of course a fair ole set of teeth! Daylight/sun is extremely harmful and yes, they crave blood. However, they are not 'undead', on the contrary, they are very much alive! It's more like one of nature's flukes, than a deliberate way of being. Natural bodily ailments (albeit extreme cases of such) can see them off, as can a bullet to the head.

It's all been a rather nice change and I'm very much liking this book. The setting is interesting too..bumbling along the Mississippi on a grand steamboat. Of course, the darker side of slavery is added to the mix too. A great read as one would expect from Ser Martin.

['thul]

Martin chose the "not-human" concept on his vampires rather than the "no-longer-human" concept that tends to be more popular with storymakers. The latter includes both the "undead" branch and the branch of "living but no longer human", and of course these branches split up even more. Undead could be the "raving dead" as typical villain vampires are, but it could also be a simple part of the change, that they are clearly different, yet act like living for the most part.

These beings prefer the vampire type that takes the "no-longer-human" key branch, yet they care not too much about whether the vampires are considered "living" or "undead", so long as it does not go down the "raving dead" path. Vampires are supposed to be blood-drinkers and predators, but they also tend to be somewhat cultured, hiding in plain sight. The "raving dead" cannot truly hide themselves, and would generally get themselves or their prey exterminated quickly.
For vampires down this key branch, it should be a more complex process than a simple bite to transform, otherwise the world population would quickly be purely vampires.

[fool-ish]

I think it's maybe his way of explaining why the world isn't overrun with vampires, when it certainly could be! Traditionally, it's all too easy for one vampire to create another. However, in this case, the likes of Joshua York have to 'get it together' to produce another of their kind, which invariably has it's own dire problems!

['thul]

These beings were speaking in general about the population thing. Martin's work isn't the only place where Vampires are a separate species that does not procreate through vampirism.

[fool-ish]

Which books are these, where procreation is the way? Fevre Dream is the only one I've come across so far.

['thul]

first one that comes to mind isn't a book, but a TV show. Sanctuary. There the species is called "Sanguine vampiris".
Could not track down books right now, but it appears to be a trait more common in the Science fiction direction of vampirism than in the fantasy direction, which makes sense, since in that first direction, they try to make it fit into laws of nature and science, even if they have to make up a few exceptions through tech or such to get it to fit.

It is also a linked to the type of vampires that are alive rather than undead, where vampirism is genetically hereditary, not just hereditary through transmission.