A song of Ice and fire discussion (spoilers incl A Dance with Dragons)

[Farseer]

Oh gods I can't believe you've finished all 5 books already.

Tonsilitis has its benefits at times!

I also can't wait to get to work so I can properly sit down and reply to a ton of stuff you've brought up in this thread as well as direct you to some new amazing theories to look over (specifically concerning Jon Snow's parentage and other Azor Ahai prophecies/theories). !!!!!!!!!!

Sounds fascinating...quick, get to work already...though I may very well be sleeping by the time you get there. It's a tick away from midnight here EDIT: It just ticked over to the 28th! END EDIT and I have to be up at 5:30am, ready to watch the Opening Ceremony of the Olympics with my daughter, bacon and eggs at the ready...or so I've been instructed!

(or, for that matter, read them at all haha),

I'd *not* have read them at all, if not for you giving me kicks up the pants...

I would have suggested you read the 3 short-stories before starting book 5. Even though the short stories are set 100 years in the past.. there are events that foreshadow and hint at things you read in the main story.

I'll get into them then...better late than never?

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Quick pronunciation question but I'm sure there'll be plenty more...

How do you all pronounce 'Arya'? Ar-ya, as in "Are ya coming or not?" or Ar-ree-ah, like the Aria Awards? Hang on , you may not know of the Aria Awards seeing as it's an Aussie thing?! Anyhoo...either of these, or some other way?

[Valarya]

As to the pronunciation.. GRRM has stated there are no official documents and you "can pronounce them however you want."

But I say her name both ways, depending on how quickly I'm speaking. Most of the time it comes out like aria (AR-ee-yah) but every once in a while, if I'm going fast, I say ARE-yuh. Hahah, does that thoroughly confuse you?

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As for the theory on who Jon Snow's parents are... I'll go ahead and point you to a wonderful essay that gives examples on WHY much better than I could. (Make sure to change the scope-of-books-read at the top of the page in order to even see the essay.)

To give you a shortened version (that is still quite long ): the majority of the community believes his parents are Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark. Mostly because of three - to - four very important things.

1. Why else would 3 of the Kingsguards be guarding Lyanna in a tower way off in the South when their king is being slaughtered in King's Landing (Aerys) and their Prince is being slaughtered on the Trident (Rhaegar)? It's because Rhaegar ordered it.. because Lyanna is carrying their son... the Prince Who Was Promised. His whose song is the song of ice and fire (oh boy I got ahead of myself.. we'll get there later, lol).

2. When have you ever known Ned to not be an honorable man? Never. Ned would never.. ever.. slip and sleep with someone else after he'd already taken wedding vows. It doesn't fit everything we know about his character. So he must be protecting someone/something. I feel the Promise me, Ned's are her asking him to keep the babe's Targaryen lineage a secret else Robert would have it 'taken care of.' Why do I think she was giving birth up in that tower? She was in a bed of blood.

3. When Dany is in the House of the Undying.. there's one sentence where she notices a Pale Blue Rose (Lyanna's flower) growing in a chink of ice (The Wall).

[fool-ish]

Arya = Ar-ee-ah....in my world anyway

@ Valaraya, I'm with the majority, I think, where the three eyed crow's identity is concerned, though I can't find any actual proof that said majority is correct? I reckon we can safely assume we're right, but the gods know GRRM does like to mess with our poor heads!

[Valarya]

I'm with the majority, I think, where the three eyed crow's identity is concerned, though I can't find any actual proof that said majority is correct? I reckon we can safely assume we're right, but the gods know GRRM does like to mess with our poor heads!

It's already proven and stamped, Fool-ish. He has a thousand eyes and one. There was a very very popular song about him 100 years ago.

[fool-ish]

I'm with the majority, I think, where the three eyed crow's identity is concerned, though I can't find any actual proof that said majority is correct? I reckon we can safely assume we're right, but the gods know GRRM does like to mess with our poor heads!

It's already proven and stamped, Fool-ish. He has a thousand eyes and one. There was a very very popular song about him 100 years ago.

I know, we can probably take it as read and the songs in this series do tend to have more than a little truth/fact to them. Don't know if I'd put a wager on it, mind!

[Valarya]

I know, we can probably take it as read and the songs in this series do tend to have more than a little truth/fact to them. Don't know if I'd put a wager on it, mind!

Short Story spoilers, sort of. If you've read aDwD you're probably fine here.

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No, I mean it's what they said of Bloodraven 100 years ago.. that he had A Thousand Eyes and One. Not just in song. Also, he's been missing an eye ever since Bittersteel stabbed it out during the Blackfyre Rebellion.

We knew that once Egg's father, Maekor, took the throne.. he had Bloodraven (former Hand of the King) put in the Black Cells. And when Egg took the throne he sent Bloodraven north with Maestor Aemon to take the black. Eventually Bloodraven made his way to Lord Commander of the Night's Watch but then disappeared one day to never be seen again. -- until ADWD

George has confirmed that it's what the short-story clues were about; so that when Bran got to the Three-Eyed Crow, and the readers saw the Thousand Eyes and One reference, they'd understand that the 3EC was really Bloodraven (Brynden Rivers.. a Targaryen Great Bastard).

[fool-ish]

I read ADWD before the short stories, so didn't put two and two together at that point (in fact, I thought the three eyed crow was someone else, until I thought about it further and decided it couldn't be) When I later read the short stories, I sussed it out..from 'a thousand eyes and one.'

All I'm saying is that I wouldn't place any large bets on us not being hoodwinked by a very large red herring..GRRM has shocked me many times before, he could well do it again, though in this case, I will admit it's highly doubtful, particularly if he's stated that we were meant to correlate the information given in the Dunk and Egg story with the three eyed crow business. Anyway, we'll see in the fullness of time...sooner rather than later, I hope!

['thul]

agreed. Its fairly probable, but nothing with GRRM is certain until a book is published verifying it. Nothing.

[fool-ish]

For sure, there's no surety in Westeros! I'd have to emigrate if I lived there and I certainly wouldn't want to be a woman...or a horse, come to that! They don't half get short shrift!

[Valarya]

I feel like I'm beating my head against a wall here, lol. It's confirmed, guys. The Three-Eyed-Crow is Bloodraven.