Others' Island (spoilers all books incl RWC)

[Farseer]

That leaves the fingernails and we've been racking our brains for some connection between the Others prophecy, the outcome that we know and the fingernails, but couldn't find anything.

We've talked about fingernails to exhaustion but one thing I didn't think about until now is the old wives' tale that recommends the cutting of fingernails to free oneself of having been pecksie-nibbled (see Distribution).

Not sure if that means anything or not BUT a fingernail connection directly from the realm nonetheless !

[Farseer]

Wintrow, Kennit, Dutiful and Fitz all managed to escape this working of magic, either through deliberate force of will or by simply escaping.

I thought of this thread when I came across this in SOM, Chapter Four - Divvytown, where Kennit's charm speaks to him after he gave the ruby (stripped from the blue kitten) to Etta - "That was likely the only bit of treasure ever carried off from the Others' Island, and you gave it to a whore."

Seemingly with its dragon memories intact, I find it interesting that the charm speaks of the island not as Others' Island, as a made-up name because they happen to inhabit the place, but 'the' Others' Island, as though it actually belongs to them in some way...or in that he recognises their right to be present as caretakers despite their being Abominations? Am I splitting hairs in this with the 'the' ?

Secondly, that the charm knows that treasure is rarely, if ever, carried off from the island (though Etta, Fitz and Dutiful are by that stage yet to also successfully take something from there) suggests that it had been that way since the time when dragons were Lords of the Three Realms, and he (the charm) held dragon memories of treasure being washed up on the beach and kept on the island etc even in ancient times? If this is the case, it would not be a behaviour brought about only by the downfall of dragons and Elderlings but one the Others have retained since prior to the cataclysm?

[Farseer]

Just quickly adding a copper feather and a handful of small crystal spheres to the list of items Kennit picked up. These he collected on the final stretch of beach, and I missed them in my very first post of the thread. I may have to go back and make sure I now have everything.

I am connecting the crystal spheres to scrying with crystals and the spherical shape makes me (at a stretch!) think of time's wheel but the copper feather leaves me with no idea whatsoever...

[Farseer]

Possibly the copper feather signifies dragons? A ‘feather’, after all, is merely Kennit’s take on what the object is, especially as he would have been more interested in what the object meant for his dreams of kingship rather than speculating on its beauty?

When he sees the golden dragon in Kelsingra, Fitz says, “The word “scale” does no justice to the ornate plates that sheathed its wings, yet “feather” is too airy a word to describe them. Could a feather be made of finely beaten gold, perhaps it might come close to the dragon’s plumage”.

Fitz later adds this while in the Stone Garden when he sees the golden and green dragon, “A great crest of feather-scales, rainbow-hued, lay lax about his throat.”

While feather is not an ‘accurate’ word, possibly it is the best fit for these two men for the purpose of their retelling? Of note is the fact that no character in the Rain Wild Chronicles (that I have been able to find), describes anything from the dragons as a “feather”...it is only ever a “scale”. I am still to check LST.

[Farseer]

A quick point re Kennit's charm...the wizardwood was placed "exactly over his pulse point"...this seemed to be particularly important for the charm to work so may have possibly contributed to the quickening also (as being different from other quickenings requiring a life force to enter it).

Another thought is that it WAS designed as a charm to ward off the glamours/magic of the Others while on the island. Possibly it quickened simply because it HAD to at that point (first when Kennit came face-to-face with the Other, it assisted him with seeing through the Other's glamour, and then the charm actually spoke to him at last, while he was upon the path and being drawn in by its attraction). Life force or no, the charm had to quicken as that is what it was made to do via the spell that had been placed on it. Once quickened, it could not revert back to being unquickened and so remained a force in Kennit's life even after they left the island.

[Bink]

A quick point re Kennit's charm...the wizardwood was placed "exactly over his pulse point"...this seemed to be particularly important for the charm to work so may have possibly contributed to the quickening also (as being different from other quickenings requiring a life force to enter it).

Another thought is that it WAS designed as a charm to ward off the glamours/magic of the Others while on the island. Possibly it quickened simply because it HAD to at that point (first when Kennit came face-to-face with the Other, it assisted him with seeing through the Other's glamour, and then the charm actually spoke to him at last, while he was upon the path and being drawn in by its attraction). Life force or no, the charm had to quicken as that is what it was made to do via the spell that had been placed on it. Once quickened, it could not revert back to being unquickened and so remained a force in Kennit's life even after they left the island.

My memory may be a bit fuzzy but isn't Kennit's wizardwood charm from the Paragon? Wasn't it one of the larger chunks that resulted from Kennit chopping Paragon's face?

That was how he murdered the entire crew by poisoning the soup with the block of wizardwood.

Given that, wouldn't the chunk of wizardwood already been quickened? Perhaps all that was needed was a face for it to function.

[Farseer]

That was how he murdered the entire crew by poisoning the soup with the block of wizardwood.

Yes, Kennit did poison the members of Igrot's crew by boiling the wizardwood from Paragon in with some soup but...

My memory may be a bit fuzzy but isn't Kennit's wizardwood charm from the Paragon? Wasn't it one of the larger chunks that resulted from Kennit chopping Paragon's face?

...no, to my understanding, it wasn't the same piece which Kennit had used for the making of his charm and therefore the charm was not of Paragon. A nice thought though, and it would be much easier to understand the quickening process if it were !

Firstly, the charm didn't seem to share any of Paragon's traits, many of which would have been fully established by the time his face was hacked by Kennit. It certainly didn't seem to share any of the love or understanding that Paragon felt for Kennit. It felt the opposite, if anything. Neither did it appear at any stage to have any kind of connection to either the Greater or the Lesser of Paragon's dragons.

It was a pact made between Kennit and Paragon that Paragon should be destroyed to take with him all memory of what Kennit had endured. This would not be true if Kennit had kept a piece of Paragon's wizardwood with him. Such an object would have been a vulnerability to Kennit and his secrets. If it got into the hands of someone else, Kennit could not be sure that his secrets would remain secrets.

In SOM we are told by Kennit that it "cost him an inordinate amount of coin to commission it. Not everyone who could carve wizardwood would, even if they had the balls to steal some...". Also, "The pirate had paid him an exorbitant advance months ago, and waited until the artist had sent him a messenger to say that he had obtained some of the precious and jealously-guarded wood."

From this, my understanding is that the artist sourced the wizardwood himself and, once he had, he sent a message to notify Kennit so that Kennit was able to sit for the crafting of his face to be done and also the spell against enchantments to be worked. It was only after the charm had been completed that Kennit was finally able to persue his dream of visiting the island of the Others. I think if he'd still had a piece of Paragon, he would have possibly considered commissioning the carving of the charm much earlier than he had, so that he could receive the Other's prophecy earlier.

[Farseer]

When people seek the prophecies or sooth-saying of an Other from the Island, they place two gold coins on its tongue. While I think we have firmly determined that they get most, if not all, of their 'far-seeing' ability from the waters taken from around She Who Remembers, WHY do they ask for a coin payment? Of what use is gold to an Other?

I thought of this previous post while re-reading the part in AA where the Red Ship Raiders demanded gold to be paid in exchange for Forged hostages to be killed. There may or may not be a connection, given we know, post-TM, that it was the Pale Woman who was pulling all of the strings at the time, but the "gold" jumped out at me.

EDIT: Sorry, the passage re gold as payment for Forged hostages comes from Chapter Nine in AA, 'Fat Suffices'.

[Nuytsia]

Possibly the copper feather signifies dragons? A ‘feather’, after all, is merely Kennit’s take on what the object is, especially as he would have been more interested in what the object meant for his dreams of kingship rather than speculating on its beauty?

Or an actual scale dropped by a copper dragon?
Or in some way linked to the feathers found on the beach that went into the rooster crown? (not sure how, probably only in some symbolic way which is lost on me!)

[Farseer]

Or an actual scale dropped by a copper dragon?

See?! Now this is why I just LOVE brainstorming here on thePlenty!!!